LETTER TO THE EDITOR: Immoral nature of homosexuality

Jun 18, 2012

 

For example, by studying homosexuality from the Bible for 10 years does not change it from sin to righteousness.

The Jews, who wrote the Old Testament, tell us that homosexuality is sin. The apostles who taught us about life-saving grace also taught us homosexuality is sin. Common sense tells us if homosexuality was sin then, it is still sin today. Studying homosexuality from the Bible for 10 or more years does not change it to righteousness.

Twenty-seven times in the New Testament, Jesus and the apostles told us to repent, and that we will repent for our sins and immorality if we are to become true Christians. We are also told not to associate with those who are immoral and claim to be Christians.

The Bible says: “I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with immoral people ... I wrote to you not to associate with any so-called brother if he is an immoral person ... not to even eat with such a one. ... Remove the wicked man from among yourselves.” (1 Corinthians 5:9, 11, 13 NASB)

The Rev. Ray Paget is correct: the Bible is unambiguous about the immoral nature of homosexuality. The immoral, atheists and intolerant toward Christians and the Rev. Paget are wrong.

— Dale TerHaar, Spring Lake
 

Comments

snlfan

Dave you and you're Rev. Ray Paget are bigots, period that is all there is to say. There is no further comment required, it's just plain fact that you're intolerance does not deserve the print you just recieved, Shame on the Tribune for allowing hate on it's forum.

Fly on the Wall

Awww fercryingoutloud, not this $#*! again.

Hey editorial staff - This crap is why I cancelled your print version. Get a clue.

newsblogger

lol no kidding.. SHUT UP ABOUT IT!! Just be what ever you want to be people and stop trying to convince each other to think like yourself.. its never going to happen! None of us are special.. gay or not.. get over yourselves!

grandhavenguy01

Dale...with all due respect, if we tuned in and obeyed the Bible for every piece of morality we are seeking, then slavery would still exist. It would also be okay to beat your wife (or wives depending on which version you were reading). It would also be okay to murder people...as long as 'God' said it was okay.

Nobody is forcing anyone to be gay or straight here. If they were, I'd probably be on your side...but the fact remains this very simple reality: If it doesn't hurt anyone, then why is it bad? Two people are in love but they can't get married because you can't talk to your kids about it for 2 seconds? Do you REALLY think it is a 'lifestyle' or 'choice??!! In nature, we've found that penguins, our beloved cute dolphins, monkeys, and other animals exhibit homosexual behavior. Do you think they 'choose'?

davewali

Did God create man in his own image?
Did God create the heavens and earth, and all things included?
If you TRULY believe that, then God also created homosexuality.

If God created homosexuality, how could it be wrong?
Because the people who wrote the Bible say so?
Perhaps they were as intolerant as you seem to be.

Who is correct...you?
Or the people among us who live by the tenet "Judge not, lest you be judged"?

thestunningmiss...

Captn Pea: Are Dale and Rev. Ray Paget bigots because YOU say they are? Is this not a free country where folks are allowed to speak their minds? Do you know for a fact the they are also intolerant? And they do not DESERVE the print to speak their side? Shame??? on the Tribune for allowing HATE????? Really Capn Pea?? Really? It sounds like YOU are the intolerant one!!

snlfan

Yes I am completely against the message that was written here and will always attempt to bring ridicule to those who broadcast such jibberish. That I am sure is my right! Calling someone immoral due to their sexual orientation no matter what version of god you are saying is and always will be immoral in and of itself. Anyone speaks in this hateful manner in my company receives the same treatement, YOU DO NOT HAVE TO TOLLERATE INTOLLERANCE

MeanSmith

Come people, we need to love one another!! We, as a community need to come together and love our neighbors, even if they are homo's because there is nothing wrong with that!!!!

Stearns1

Can we all get along?

HavenWillie

Maybe we are looking at this backwards. Instead of thinking there is something wrong with homosexuality....maybe there is something wrong with the bible. I think the letter writer is inadvetently making this point.

Josephine Kilroy

Statements made by some people are quite convincing-against their point of view.

Josephine Kilroy

Sadly, since it was written, man has used the bible to justify hatred for others. Contrary to the belief of many "Christians", the bible was not written by God. It was written by man, and then interpreted by man. God is pure love, perfection. He created us, and gave us two things: FREE WILL, and GOD's LOVE. These are the two constants. He does not tell us how to live. The bible, written by man, tries to tell us how to live. If you really read the message of the bible, you will clearly see that NONE of it is from God. The words in the bible are not love. They are condemnation, threats, warnings, anger, hatred, and coercion. Again, I will state that the bible was not written by God. The bible does not come from God. THE BIBLE COMES FROM DARKNESS.
"All Darkness Leaves Me Now"

ZakBagans

Ok...1st of all..."Homosexuality"...when a "man" loves another "man" it's because the soul in one is masculine...and the soul in the other is feminine...IT IS ONE PERSON (SOUL) LOVING ANOTHER PERSON (SOUL)...God IS LOVE...and He wants us to LOVE EACH OTHER...The reason people think they can judge each other is because they THINK God judges us...when in fact HE DOESN'T!!! He LOVES us and lets us live life using the FREE WILL and LOVE He gave us...If people would stop being blind and STOP using the bible to justify HATING EVERYONE ELSE then maybe people would see God for what He really is...PURE LOVE!!!

ghmomma

Oh ZakBagans, that is WONDERFUL.....!

Lenus

I find it not only funny but rather sad that there are people that can believe that the things in the bible actually happened and then want to follow it or at least the parts that suit them and ignore the rest...

How many people have this rev and Rev. Ray Paget and Dale TerHaar stoned to death? Do they also believe in slavery and I can go on and on......

It just shows how bad our education system really is in West Michigan when people can believe what is in a fairy tale book versus real science. I use to think the best thing to do with simple minded people like this was to ignore them but have come to the realization that we really need to stand up to them.

Go ahead keep living in your simple little world I would rather listen to people like PZ Myers.....

ghmomma

How sad that someone can be so mean spirited and so full of hate. Think of what these people must be going through. The world WILL eventually see that love is love and accept the fact that if you love someone, that is all that matters. Six states (and DC) have legalized same sex marriage. Here in little 'ol Grand Haven there are gay and lesbian couples that have been married in one of these states living their lives here---just like everyone else. Don't ask don't tell is history. The war that the homophobic haters are fighting is over. Thankfully more people every day are realizing how silly it is to focus on what other people might be doing in the privacy of their own bedrooms. So think about it.......these hateful little men are probably scared out of their friggin' minds!! What sad little lives they must lead if they have to focus on someone else's sex lives. If they weren't so nasty we could all feel very sorry for them....

Zippy Jones

“Some people say that homosexuality is a sin. It’s not, God is perfectly cool with it, and he feels the same way about homosexuality as heterosexuality. Now you might say ‘Whoa, whoa, slow down, you move too fast. How could you have the audacity, no, the temerity to speak on behalf of God?’ Exactly. That’s an excellent point, and I pray you remember it.”
— Ted Alexandro

anonymous

"Western philosophy, the Body of Christ (or the Christian Church) and common sense all tell us that if something is true or false, it is always true or false and never changes."

Actually, I would like to point out that you're wrong. For a very long time, the Church believed that the Earth was in the center of the universe and that everything orbited the Earth. When Copernicus showed them otherwise, they threw him in a dungeon and was later put on house arrest. So, the statement that you have made in your introductory paragraph is actually quite wrong. Things change all the time (For example, our society), and nothing is completely true or false. As humans that once descended from primates that once descended from fish (etc.), we are very susceptible to change. For example, take our society. The way that we look at life now is completely different compared to the 1950s. As a human race, we don't stick to one thing. We change and adapt, and that is what makes us such a beautiful thing. Now, in regards to religion, the people who initially wrote the bible may have said that homosexuality is a sin (I highly doubt that God thinks so), but they also said that it is perfectly okay to have multiple wives and to sell off daughters. Now, with that logic in mind, don't you think that religion has changed? Yes, it has. If it hadn't, we wouldn't be where we are today. Since religion has been altered so much, it is hard to tell what is right and wrong. But maybe that is the point - there really is no definitive right and wrong. It's all just a gray area based on perceptions and judgements. So, maybe it's time to take the ignorance from your mind and evolve.

ohm529

I always find it interesting when people claim to follow the teachings of Jesus util this subject comes up. Then they run straight to the old testament. When did Jesus preach intolerance or hate? "Let heis without sin cast the first stone." Kind of sad that an athiest needs to remind you of the teachings in your own religion.

No One Special

Jesus said "Do not think that I have come to abolish the law [Old Testament] or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place." (Matthew 5:17). He also gave this lesson regarding the law and its relationship to sin: "Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law" (1 John 3:4). Last,
Jesus also said that unless you repent of your sins you will perish. (Luke 13:3)

jvc

Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. (NIV) — Leviticus 25:44

No One Special

Here is what I don't like about your response....you never address any part of my response to you. Instead you divert attention to a different "red herring" issue which I will again answer. It's a lengthy response, and for the record, it is from a source other than me. By the way, please remember it was largely a Christian effort that lead to the abolishment of slavery in our own Country. When a Hebrew becomes a slave because of debt. And if one of your brethren who dwells by you becomes poor, and sells himself to you, you shall not compel him to serve as a slave. As a hired servant and a sojourner he shall be with you, and shall serve you until the Year of Jubilee. And then he shall depart from you; he and his children with him; and shall return to his own family. He shall return to the possession of his fathers. For they are My servants, whom I brought out of the land of Egypt; they shall not be sold as slaves. You shall not rule over him with rigor, but you shall fear your God. And as for your male and female slaves whom you may have; from the nations that are around you, from them you may buy male and female slaves. Moreover you may buy the children of the strangers who dwell among you, and their families who are with you, which they beget in your land; and they shall become your property. And you may take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them as a possession; they shall be your permanent slaves. But regarding your brethren, the children of Israel, you shall not rule over one another with rigor. a. You shall not compel him to serve as a slave: In the Mosaic law, if one chronically could not pay his debts, he would have to work off the debt as a servant of his creditor. But these laws command fair, just and compassionate treatment of any Jewish man so unfortunate. b. Shall serve you until the Year of Jubilee: Not only must such a servant be released when his debt was paid, but he also must be released at the year of Jubilee. c. And as for your male and female slaves whom you may have; from the nations that are around you, from them you may buy male and female slaves: Foreign slaves among the Jews did not have the same rights as Hebrew slaves sold into servitude because of debt; they could be held as slaves for life, though they had to be treated humanely (Exodus 20:8-11; 21:20-21). Slavery was permitted in the Bible because of sin in the world. It existed before the Jews were formed as a nation and it existed after Israel was conquered. God allows many things to happen in the world such as storms, famine, murder, etc. Slavery, like divorce, is not preferred by God. Instead, it is allowed. Where many nations treated their slaves very badly, the Bible gave many rights and privileges to slaves. So, even though it isn't the best way to deal with people, because God has allowed man freedom, slavery then exists. God instructed the Israelites to treat them properly. The Bible acknowledged the slave’s status as the property of the master (Ex. 21:23; Lev. 25:46), The Bible restricted the master’s power over the slave. Ex. 21:20). The slave was a member of the master’s household (Lev. 22:11) The slave was required to rest on the Sabbath (Exodus 20:10; Deut. 5:14) The slave was required and to participate in religious observances (Gen. 17:13; Exodus 12:44; Lev. 22:11). The Bible prohibited extradition of slaves and granted them asylum (Deut. 23:16-17). The servitude of a Hebrew debt-slave was limited to six years (Ex. 21:2; Deut. 15:12). When a slave was freed, he was to receive gifts that enabled him to survive economically (Deut. 15:14) The reality of slavery cannot be denied. Slaves were "slave labor played a minor economic role in the ancient Near East, for privately owned slaves functioned more as domestic servants than as an agricultural or industrial labor force."1

jvc

I don't understand which response you are talking about. If I am reading this correctly, does this mean that slavery is ok as long as it's not any of the children of Israel? Matthew 18:25: "But forasmuch as he had not to pay, his lord commanded him to be sold, and his wife, and children, and all that he had, and payment to be made." 1 Timothy 6: "Let all who are under the yoke of slavery regard their masters as worthy of all honor, so that the name of God and the teaching may not be defamed."

PeopleAreAmazing

As a man....I think some bigots are kinda cute....clueless, yes - - - but still, kinda cute.....

SLAlumni 09

Proof that Spiderman exist= a copy from any marvel spiderman comic book.

Proof that God exist= The bible.

.........

tednugent4pres

Moderators have removed this comment because it contained profanity. Discussion Guidelines

Jess

What? What IS this?! I can't believe someone would send in a letter to a newspaper talking about their hatred of homosexuals.

Let me ask you, didn't Leviticus also talk about not cutting your hair? Or eating "unclean meat"? If you say that "something is true or false, it is always true or false and never changes", then cutting your hair IS a sin, according to a BIBLE, and i doubt you are following that one. It's like you are PICKING and CHOOSING what you believe. If you're going to follow one thing in Leviticus, then you should follow all of them.

And, excuse me, but i thought God loved EVERYONE. And by saying that " The immoral, atheists and intolerant toward Christians and the Rev. Paget are wrong", YOU are being the intolerant ones. Intolerant of HUMANS. Stop being so close minded. PEOPLE ARE PEOPLE. Times change, and many things in Leviticus have been forgotten. I don't understand why people still choose to believe in the one that expresses hate towards other human beings.

I can't believe people. This article fills me with so much fury.

soip

Oh my gosh people!!! God surely must be smacking his head at the blatant ignorance of His people! What some of you commenters are failing to realize is that while, yes the Leviticus laws condemn homosexuality among some other sins that we may find silly now in this day, true christians are now covered in Grace through Jesus Christ and His sacrifice for us, that took away the need for sacrifices and other such things that just don't apply to us today.....but one thing holds true and well into the new testament as wrong and still to this day very "SINFUL" and unnatural, which is homosexuality!! 1 Corinthians 6:9-11, 9 "Don’t you realize that those who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God? Don’t fool yourselves. Those who indulge in sexual sin, or who worship idols, or commit adultery, or are male prostitutes, or practice HOMOSEXUALITY, 10 or are thieves, or greedy people, or drunkards, or are abusive, or cheat people—none of these will inherit the Kingdom of God. 11 Some of you were once like that. But you were cleansed; you were made holy; you were made right with God by calling on the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God." 1 Timothy 1:8-11, 8 "We know that the law is good when used correctly. 9 For the law was not intended for people who do what is right. It is for people who are lawless and rebellious, who are ungodly and sinful, who consider nothing sacred and defile what is holy, who kill their father or mother or commit other murders. 10 The law is for people who are sexually immoral, or who practice HOMOSEXUALITY, or are slave traders, liars, promise breakers, or who do anything else that contradicts the wholesome teaching 11 that comes from the glorious Good News entrusted to me by our blessed God." The Bible is not just some book written by a bunch of men. It is God-breathed and should NOT be taken lightly! 2 Timothy 3:16-17, 16 "All Scripture is inspired by God and is useful to teach us what is true and to make us realize what is wrong in our lives. It corrects us when we are wrong and teaches us to do what is right. 17 God uses it to prepare and equip his people to do every good work." God is unchanging, His word is unchanging, and people need to wisen up before its too late!! All I can say is THANK YOU Rev. Ray Paget for continuing to spread God's TRUE word among all those who have waivered in their faith and are spreading false teachings, which is all predicted for the end times! Prayers being lifted up for all.

freethinker

"yes the Leviticus laws condemn homosexuality among some other sins that we may find silly now in this day, true christians are now covered in Grace through Jesus Christ and His sacrifice for us, that took away the need for sacrifices and other such things that just don't apply to us today.....but one thing holds true and well into the new testament as wrong and still to this day very "SINFUL" and unnatural, which is homosexuality!!"

What makes someone a "true christian" in your eyes? shouldn't it be up to God?
some of the leviticus laws that are "silly now in this day"--that shellfish, pork, and rabbit are sinful foods? that you can't wear some mixed-fiber materials? "Neither shall a garment mingled of linen and woolen come upon thee." -- Leviticus 19:19 oops! Leviticus 19:27 forbids you from shaving your beard. Oh, and menstruation makes a woman impure, as well as everything she touches while menstruating (Leviticus 15:19-20). Who are you to say that homosexuality laws are not "silly"? are you the new messiah? Is it because homosexuality is still written about in the New Testament? If this is so, why even keep leviticus in the book? there are also "silly" laws in the New Testament, so have fun picking through these:
-"But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. If your right eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell" Matthew 5:28-30
-Marrying a divorced woman is adultery. (Matthew 5:32)
-Don't plan for the future. (Matthew 6:34)
-Don't save money. (Matthew 6:19-20)
-Don't become wealthy. (Mark 10:21-25)
-Sell everything and give it to the poor. (Luke 12:33)
-Don't work to obtain food. (John 6:27)
-Don't have sexual urges. (Matthew 5:28)

and, perhaps most importantly, Jesus said that whoever calls somebody a "fool" shall be in danger of hell fire (Matthew 5:22). have fun :)

sirhansalot

I was told jesus had a lot of woman in his day, Is this true?And what book are you guys reading? Sounds like a grand tale.....

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